Marcum's status murky

TORONTO – There is still no news about the status of Jays starter Shaun Marcum, but the extent of the lack of update seemed almost cryptic. Basically, Marcum underwent an MRI on his right arm, but the Jays won’t say what the results are just yet.

Instead, Toronto is getting a second opinion from arm specialist Dr. James Andrews and plans on announcing the extent of Marcum’s injury on Friday. Marcum, meanwhile, said his forearm is still tender, though there’s no more numbness in his hand.

“Right now, we’re still looking at results and we’ll probably know a little bit more tomorrow,” Blue Jays manager Cito Gaston said. “They still want to look at it a little more before I can say anything to you guys. They want to make sure what they’re seeing is what they’re seeing.”

If what they’re seeing requires surgery, that would immediately put Marcum in doubt to break camp with the Jays at the start of 2009. So, behind Roy Halladay, you’re talking about a mix of Jesse Litsch, Casey Janssen, David Purcey, Ricky Romero, Brett Cecil and maybe Scott Richmond for starting jobs.

“It just means one of the other kids has to step up and go in that role,” Toronto general manager J.P. Ricciardi said. “Hopefully, it won’t come to that, but I guess you’ve got to prepare for the worst-case scenario.”

There’s the chance that the Jays would consider Scott Downs or Brian Wolfe as starters. Dustin McGowan could be out until May. A.J. Burnett could opt out and become a free agent. In the latter department, Ricciardi did not that the Jays are willing to explore adding a year or two on Burnett’s contract to maybe convince him to stick around.

“We’d love to have him stay,” Ricciardi said. “But if someone wants to blow him out of the water, that won’t be us. We would think about that, adding some years, but we’re not going to get in a bidding war. There’s got to be an interest on his part to stay, too.”

As for catcher Rod Barajas, he has a Grade 2 tear of his left hamstring and could be done for the season. Downs is still day to day with a right ankle injury. Me? I’m injury free — over a nasty bout of tendinitis — and counting down the days to the Chicago Marathon on Oct. 12. Last thing I need is hamstring or ankle issues. Arm problems I can deal with…

Today’s lineups:

BALTIMORE (67-83) at TORONTO (81-71)
at 7:07 p.m. ET at the Rogers Centre

ORIOLES
Brian Roberts, 2B
Alex Cintron, SS
Nick Markakis, RF
Aubrey Huff, 3B
Kevin Millar, 1B
Luke Scott, LF
Oscar Salazar, DH
Jay Payton, CF
Omir Santos, C

PITCHING: LHP Garrett Olson (9-8, 6.84)

BLUE JAYS
Marco Scutaro, SS
Jose Bautista, 2B
Alex Rios, RF
Vernon Wells, CF
Adam Lind, DH
Scott Rolen, 3B
Lyle Overbay, 1B
Curtis Thigpen, C
Travis Snider, LF

PITCHING: RHP Jesse Litsch (11-8, 3.75)

48 Comments

Bad news with Marcum, maybe not able to break camp with the Jays next year, and with the possible/likely loss of Burnett. We are really going to need someone to step up in the rotation.

In light of that, since gsumner hasn’t been on in a while. Here is a little minors report, even though the season is over.

Brett Cecil finished the season semi-strong with Syracuse. Aug. 17 and Aug. 23 he threw 7.0 shutout innings against Buffalo and Rochester. Got hit up on the 28th against the Las Vegas Area 57’s, at least I think thats what they were.

Ricky Romero, had two strong starts to finish the season against Rochester and the Scranton Yankees. He picked up two wins in 14 innings, only giving up two runs between both games. His record is 3-3 with a 3.38 ERA in 7 starts this season with the Skychiefs. Pretty average, but nice to see him succeeding at AAA, more so that he has at the lower levels where he has been awful.

Suddenly our rotation does not look like it once was. The depth of our pitching may really be tested in ’09.

Dr. James Andrews is Dr. Tommy John surgery. Cross you fingers guys, Marcum could be gone till spring of 2010.

By the way Jordan, have the Jays ever given an update on Accardo’s visit or consultation with Dr. Andrews.

wow. They haven’t even started 2009 and their is already some injury concerns. The Jays need a break.

GSJ you asked me last night why I would want Ibanez

Games – 152 Ab-595 R-82 H-182 2B-43 HR-23 RBI-106 OBP-.370 SLG.-.504 AVG- .306

Tell me who those ” If’s ” are who will hit for more homeruns and a better average making majore league minimum ? Ibanez will ask for more than 5.5 million but I would take a chance on him for sure. He’ll cost less then the bigger fish and can produce pretty well. He’s had atleast 4 straight seasons of 20 + homeruns or more and 3 straight with 100+ RBI’s. Sounds like a guy the Jays could use as a DH to me. Also did I miss something ? because I don’t understand how you initially made an arguement that the Jays wont have enough money to get a big bat but then you go and ask for Texiera. A guy who will likely ask for the most money and longest term (which you also made an issue about) out of all them. I’d love Texeira too but that is arguably the least likliest of happening. In the same paragraph you said that the Jays can’t afford A.J. and then go on to say, use the 20 million to sign Texeira. PLease explain that because it doesn’t make sense to me. If they can’t grab Manny or Giambi i’d be happy with Ibanez. I think if they use the money to sign him and find a way to bring back A.J. with an almost full season of Hill, Wells and Lind that should produce enough offense on most nights with the pitching staff they have.

Amazing how Rios should now be traded for a number 2 starter, atleast according to someone last night. In December when Riccardi offered Rios for Lincicum (who’s having a great year by the way) most people were criticizing J.P. for even thinking about it. I was one of the few who wanted it to happen. I think Garry was one too. J.P. would’ve looked like a genious had he pulled that off, it’s a shame it didn’t happen. Lincicum is having a great year on an even more offensively challenged team.

welikeroy

Our starters and potential starters for 2009, include Halliday, Litsch, Purcey and McGowan by mid May. We’ll have to see what the fine Dr. says about Marcum-hopefully we get good news.

Potentials include Janssen, Cecil, Romero and in a stretch-Brad Mills-AA. OF course, the Jays will list Richmond and Parrish as well, but I wouldn’t. They have also talked about stretching out Downs-which I think is a mistake, but the might be one or two candidates in the pen to be stetched.

Enigma
What you haven’t explained in you exuburance on Ibanez is why do we need 3 left fielders-particulary one that will turn 37 next year and demand 8 million?
Why sign a designated DH, when we can rotate an outfielder through the slot, two of which make about major league minimum and will both probably deliver the same results. Why do you want to keep adding these old guys-haven’t you had enough of them with Thomas, Eckstein, Wilkerson, Stewart, Mench, Clayton, etc. etc. etc. None of them worked out (except Thomas for 3 months) and you want to sign another.

What I said is the Jays can’t afford both Aj and a big bat. Tiexera is a bit different, since if we sign him for 20 and trade Overbay, it really is only a net cost of 13, because Overbay is scheduled to make 7.

As I said yesterday, we’ver had a full season of AJ at his best and the best pitching in baseball and we’re struggling to win 3rd place. Bring back AJ at 20 mill. per year is a mistake because it will leave us no flexibility to add bats or at least significant bats. We need hitters.

What the hell are you babbling about in Rios. I have never been in favor of trading Rios. Get your facts straight Enigma and tone down a bit, there’s no need to be so confrontational, unless of course you want others to be the same.

Garry mentioned trading Rios. I never lumped you into that and my apologies if it came across that way.

I never said sign A.J. for 20 million. That would be ludicris. I did say bring him back though and i’d offer a longer term take it or leave it. If not there is always guys like Dempster for example or the low risk, potentially high reward route with a Pedro Martinez. Texiera from what I hear is going to ask for atleast 25 million, even if it’s not that much then what do you do about the term ? you mentioned that as a concern too (2 nights ago) which is a legitement one because he wont be coming here for just 2 or 3 yrs.

I don’t think it’s a good idea to rotate a couple of young players in and out of the DH role becuase they are so young and i’d like to see them develop defensively as well if it’s possible, hence me wanting Ibanez to fill that role. Lind had a great September 2 yrs ago and still needed some time in triple A before he came up, it could be the same for Snider who is still just 20. Ibanez has proven that he’s good for about 20+ homeruns and 100 RBI’s. You can’t expect those types of numbers from Snider, yet.

Eckstein could’ve actually been a good second baseman without Hill but Gaston didn’t seem to see that. Once Gaston had no use for him it was only logical to trade for him. That had nothing to do with age though.

The Thomas experience taught me (if I were J.P.) not to sign older players to bad contracts with vesting options. I’ll still take a chance on guys who are in their late 30’s so long as they produce (i.e. Manny, Ibanez, Giambi, Thome or Delgado if available.) The rest of the guys you mentioned just suck and shouldn’t have been brought in in the first place. With the exception of Stewart who if healthy could’ve been a decent leadoff man.
I’d like to add too that most of them cost very little in relative terms. It’s a low risk, potentially high reward thing.

**i meant trade him.

JP said he doesen’t see any reason to look for a big bat next year,also if Burnett opts out some of the young guys will just have to step up.Now does that look like there will be any money to spend.And Baustista will be back next year for sure.Our only hope is the new president will give JP his walking papers,7 years with no results is no good.

Enigma at the start of the season I thought Rios would be a force to rekon with so I was not in favor of trading him,But as an after thought I wish they would have made the trade.
The only problem is would they have kept Johnson or would they still have cut him loose and left us short in the outfield.If so then the trade would haven been bad for this year but good for next year.

What the Thomas experience should teach all of us, is to not sign 35-40 yr olds to 10-15 million dollar contracts-period; the steroid era is over. The problem with Manny, Giambi and Delgado is, they’re all going to want 3-4 years at about 15-20 mill per year. I’d rather see us sign Tiexeira (who’s 28) even if it’s for more money and longer term, although the rumor is 18-20 mill and 7 years is what Scott Boras is looking for, which I doubt he’ll get.

Rotating the outfielders worked for Cito before and it’s the right thing to do this time. All it really means is each outfielder playing dh every 4th day. Frankly, it will keep them all fresh and more importantly eliminate the need for a designated dh, making the roster more flexible. Next year it could mean the difference between keeping or lossing one of Macdonald, Scutaro or Inglett. Besides, I have a lot more confidence in Cito bringing Snider and Lind along faster than anyone we have in AAA, although it does look like Snider is loving it up here.

Nice hit but dumb base running by Zaun.

Another nice outing from Jessie, hopefully we hold this one for a win.

Litsch looked like he was upset when Cito told him he was done for the night,but I think it was the right move and like gsj.said let’s hope the Jays hold on to give him a win.

gsjays:
What the Thomas signing really shows is that the Jays, at least under JP’s management, cannot attract quality free agents. Those they can attract are old and past their prime. Even these type of players we have to pay for dearly. About this time last year, i was talking about Tampa taking the division. This year they might. I also talked about the fact that the Jays would finish 4th. They still might. Let’s not kid ourselves folks, next year this team is not finishing any higher in the standings than it is this year. AJ will leave. Like all teams we can expect to loose at least one starter to injury. We keep hearing that our hitters have had off years. I don’t think so. I think they are what they are at this stage in their careers. I love the Jays, but they are not going to compete next year, just like the last 7 years.

Go Cubs!

Look out everyone here comes BJ I have my eyes closed.

Burt I’m with you on the Cubs.

burt
Yes, I called for the Jays to finish 4th as well. I knew TB were going to be better than us this year, although I never thought they’d take the division.
We need a complete overall, both Godfrey and JP need to be replaced. The thing that really caught me off guard was the miniscule revenue per ticket of under $18.00 and still drawing under 3 million per year. Their attendence jumped in 2006 and has leveled off ever since and the average price per seat has actually dropped. That is not good news and I’m sure something Rogers are concerned about. If they’re not, they really should be. We need to see that average ticket get closer to 30-40.00 and attendance pop to 3 million+ so the player budget can be increased. Of course we need a competent GM to spend it wisely, as well.

Catcher interference, what the hell was that about?

Now thats what I call exciting.My heart was in my mouth.

Well, the one thing Ryan does do is keep everyone interested until the 3rd out.

gsy.Zaun stuck his glove up and the bat hit it.

its a good thing Zaun hit the double to drive in two runs, because his glove error and running error are not very pretty.

There is absolutely no way we see Texiera playing for the Jays . 1) The Jays can’t afford him …2)the Yanks want him to replace Giambi ..3) Boston is looking at him to play first and moving Youk over to third, especially now Lowell needs surgery …. 4) Boras is looking for atleast 20 mil per year and 7-10 years and 5) Let me repeat Jays don’t have the money for him plus pick up Overbay’s salary and Ryan’s salary. Its easy to say trade a player but in reality far more difficult to do it . If Jays don’t want these guys why would you think another team would be willing to pay out that money for them

As for the Thomas signing JP was bidding against himself . Thomas was way overpaid but I have to give JP kudos for letting Thomas go . They obviously saw something or didn’t see something in Thomas this year and as it turns out Thomas has been on the DL most of the year . It was a good decision and a costly mistake

Indigo
What Boras has stated in Pr’s I’ve seen is 5-7 years and between 18-20 per year. I do think we can trade Overbay although we might have to pick up a mill or two of his salary for 09 and 10. Boras will sign wherever he gets the best deal for his client. I expect NY to pick up Giambi’s option for 2009. Giambi’s numbers aren’t far off Tiexeiras and NY do tend to keep guys who performed for them in the grand zoo of NY.
Ryan isn’t tradeable now, BUT, if he recovers more in the off season (and I expect he will) he will be tradeable next year and he’s under valued compared to Riviera and what Rodriguez will get, so I doubt if we’d have to pick up any of his salary. Burnett will definately opt out, so we could lose 27 million in 2009 salary-assuming we pick up 2 mill per year for Overbay. That should be enough room to sign Tiexeria.

The real problem contracts as I see it hit us in 2010 with Rolen, Wells, Rios, Ryan, Overbay and Halliday costing us over 78 million. So, although there might be some room in 2009, 2010 becomes damn difficult. The issue over and above some bad contracts is the low level gate receipts and the low level average per seat. The Jays need to grow the revenue side, get 3 million seats sold per year at a much more respectable $30 average and raise gate revenue in order to be competitive. I have no idea why the average cost per seat is dropping; I don’t think that’s the case in other MLB venues-although I’m not sure.

If we cannot do that, then I don’t see a lot of option but to blow the team up, trade for high level prospects and re-build like TB has and Oakland are-unless of course fans here are happy with 3rd and 4th place finishes each year.

Thomas had a vesting option which guaranteed him 10 million for 2009 if he had a particular number of at bats in 2007 and 2008. JP very rightly recognized Thomas would hit the number in 2008, and dumped him. It had nothing to do with “seeing something” other than the small writing on a dumb contract. I give JP full marks for dumping him, but then again why give him that option when no other team was seriously bidding for him.

I still don’t believe Texiera is on the Jays radar nor will he be and everything I have read says they , Boras and Tex , are looking for atleast 20 mil and 7-10 years …its just not going to happen . According to the article link you posted last night , you agreed that Jays won’t save any money but their payroll will actually go up , so how can we lose 27 mil in salary …you can’t have it both ways .

I know about Thomas vesting interest and I agree it played a roll in his being let go but I also believe they saw a difference in him this year . The way he held himself and his swing were not the same as last year , there was an article on this very site about that . I believe both contributed to Thomas demise .

As for the ticket price , Jays have $2.00 tuesdays that drag prices down . Plus I have bought tickets last minute at reduced rates , along with company tickets that are offered at better rates and group tickets. Its nice to say raise ticket prices but then you run the possibility of losing patrons . Who knows maybe this is the venue Roger’s chose to use as a tax write off , all large companies have them

The gate is not the only revenue for Rogers,TV rights food and drink and many more items.Don’t for a minute think Rogers is loseing money.

Drop the e in losing.

Kate.
Did you read my last post to you.

Ron Lancaster was an icon in Canadian football,It is a sad day for all sask.football fans,I for one will never forget him.

gsjays:
With regards to ticket prices. Remember, an average is a terrible statistic because it can be easily skewed (e.g., $2 Tuesdays). A more appropriate statistic would be the median (middle) price. That said, keep in mind that it is a shell game. You lower ticket prices only to raise the price of a hot dog, coke, and bag of popcorn, parking, and all of the other stuff they sell at the game. I don’t know how bad the financial woes for the Jays are, keeping in mind that when they budgeted they would have used US currency, and we know that the Canadian dollar is much stronger now compared to the US buc. I am sure revenue is not where Rogers would like to see it, but all the money in the world cannot make up for bad decisions and a lack of young competitive talent – just ask the Yanks. The difference between the Yanks and the Jays is that the Yanks are honest enough to admit that there is a problem. Last night on the broadcast, JP was actually quite smug and proud of what the team had accompished. He played the injury card, yet again. The difference between Yankee fans and Jays’ fans is that the Yankee fans would have run JP’s butt out of here long ago. They would not have become aplogists for his dismal performance.

The point, I am trying to make with ticket prices and revenue is, I think the Jays are at a cross roads. I guess I owe an apology to Enigma and Indigo since I’ve really been trying to present both sides of the situation in order to expose both sides of the argument.

Documents filed for 2007 show the club lost money and the total gate revenue was only $42 million which is less than 1/4 of what it is in Boston and New York, our two major competitors in the AL east. Both NY and Boston control their own refreshment areas as well and have the further benefit of owning their TV networks, which in both cases are worth billions. Frankly, I understand 1/2 the gate revenue of either Boston or NY, but not 1/4.
Remember as well, 2007 was the year the Jays enjoyed a huge swing in dollar currency, 2008 and likely 2009 will represent a currency loss versus gain of 2007.

Yes, we will lose some contracts this year, and that might or might not give us some flexibility to add a big bat, but raises already in place eat up most of that salary loss. It’s also,very likely the equalization payment received from MLB in 2009 will drop as a result of NY opening their own building and becoming (potentially) a reciepient of revenue sharing versus a giver-unless MLB change the current rules. In addition, we are not increasing the number of fans going to games-that seems to be stuck in the 2.3-2.4 million range, so it’s likely revenue in 2009 will drop and costs will rise, unless something is done.

Looking beyond 2009 to 2010 isn’t any prettier, since raises scheduled for 6 players will committ 78 million before we look at the other 19 players on the roster. By the way Indigo, no corporation goes looking for tax losses; non cash tax write-offs yes, but not operating losses.

So, in my view, the Jays either go with the gusto, sign guys like Tiexiera and Hudson and promote like hell to increase ticket sales to the 3 mill.+ range and change some of the give away ( $2.00 Tuesdays become $5.00 Tuesdays) promotions. Hopefully, this results in significantly higher revenue, or they crater the team and trade for prospects to rebuild, like Oakland have done.

The other issue for Rogers is, do you really trust the same two guys to “go with the gusto” or crater the team who put you into this situation or replace them. Of course, Rogers do have a 3rd altenative, they can just keep writting checks so both Godfrey and JP can stay in their playpen. Those checks appear to me to be looking rather substanial in 2010 though.

It will be interesting to see whether a real decision on future direction is taken or whether Rogers just put their head in the sand and throw more money at it and keep this team muddling in mediocrity for the foreseeable future.

It’s all well and good to fantisize about landing a player like Teixeira. However, his agent is Boras. And Boras is famous for getting blood from a stone – Exibit A – A Rod, or if you don’t believe me, just ask anyone in Texas. Teixeira is one of the top 5 players in all of baseball and will be paid as such. He will get a minimum of $20M / yr.
Also, I’ve noticed that there have been a lot of “trade Overbay” comments in the last couple of days. Easier said than done. Where do you plan on trading him? The only teams in the AL that have less productive 1B are the cash strapped A’s and Seatle. Is the NL any different? No. Only San Fran and Washington. So, if the Jays want to trade Overbay they only have 2 choices: Seatle, Washington, or San Fransisco.
Speaking of San Fran, I called it in the off-season and hindsight is 20/20, Rios for Lincecum would have been a S-T-E-A-L. Rios is having a very average year and Lincecum is busy reeling in a Cy Young. Now there is no way that SF would even consider dealing him, well, at least not until his arbitration years are over.
Back to the Jays. The reason that they are where they are is not because they have made mistakes signing certain players. It is because their farm system has failed to produce. They have been FORCED into spending money in the free agent market because their minor leaguers are not ready yet. Their track record for home grown tallent is brutal. Who have the Jays brought up through their farm system in the last 5 years? Rios, Hill, McGowan, Marcum, Snider?. Compare that to anyone else:
Red Sox – Pedroia, Youk, Pappelbon, Lester, Ellsbury, Lowrie? – note they traded away Hanley Ramirez
Mets – Wright, Maine, Reyes – note they traded away Kazmir
Phillies – Howard, Utley, Hammels
Rockies – Holliday, Atkins, Tulo, Jimanez, Hawpe, Francis, Stewart?
Rays – Crawford, Longoria, Upton, Shields, Price? – note they traded away D Young
D-Backs – Webb, Jackson, Upton, Young, Drew, Reynolds, Scherzer
Dodgers – Martin, Billingsley, Kemp, Ethier, Loney, Broxton, Kershaw
Brewers – Fielder, Braun, Hardy, Weeks, Gallardo, Hart
Twins – Morneau, Mauer, Liriano, Slowey, Baker
I could keep going, but I’ve made my point. It’s not even close. You can clearly see that there is a huge difference between the Jays and these other teams. Some teams can and do buy championships (Yankees), but most of the teams that are good now, or will be in the next 2-3 years are good because they grew their talent in-house and signed and/or traded for the last piece or two of the puzzle. The Jays farm system is clearly the problem. They need to access whether the issue is drafting the wrong players, or not having the coaching staff in place to develop the players properly. Note that I am not saying that the Jays have the worst farm system in the league. Simply that they are lagging behind enough teams that a change is necessary.

I’d like to throw this one out there for you guys.

Why the heck doesn’t the Jays try to go for a peskier style of play? Wells/Rios/Hill are about the only tangible base stealing threats at the moment. And at that, only Rios seems to run (and lets be honest, he’s a bit of a bonehead on the basepaths). Rather than try to constantly land the big fish – why aren’t we looking at people who role-play a bit better. Why aren’t we looking for speed. Why aren’t we looking for execution?

Reed Johnson (Enjoy the playoffs buddy, you deserve it) was the player I’m talking about – Mighty Joe Inglett is his current incarnation. Instead of aging sluggers and overpaid arms, lets go after people that fill our needs.

Shortstop for example. Johnny Mac is the man on D but can’t hit a lick. Is there a middle ground there?

I like the idea of an Overbay / Rolen style corner infielder, but the doubles are meaningless without speed in front of them to score.

It feels like JP has an idea, incorporates it, but forgets to think about the knock on effect around the other players…Case in point. Frank Thomas can drive in runs, but everyone hitting behind him suffers because he can only advance base to base.

So what I’m putting to you guys is – can you folks think of some solid team players around the rest of the league who would fit this mold. I’d love to bash that one about for a while.

gs,
Rogers bought the Jays for 120mil in 2000, its now valued at 325 mil . My point was not that Rogers sought out a company to write off but maybe he isn’t so concerned about the ticket revenue because it does give him a tax break, something all companies look for . The 1.5 mil loss in ticket revenue is not that staggering when the Jays still go up in value .

swagman ,
I agree and said last year Jays need to play more small ball . I actually think they would do better in the NL league

swag.
Stealing a base in T.O. is almost a criminal offence.Remember when JP first came here he did not like the running game and I still don’t think he does,All you have to do is look at the players he has signed over the years.
This is the line up I would like to see in Toronto.[It will never happen]
Hudson SECOND

Johnson LF-DH

Wells CF-DH

Teixeira FIRST

Rios RF-DH

Rolen THIRD

Hill SHORT

Snider DH-RF

Barajas CATCHER

On the bench-Inglet-John MacDonald-Scuttaro-One of the young guns as the back up catcher

garry ,

I just saw your questions. I need to head back to work but I will think about them and try to give you my answers tonight …. Take care all and have a great day

My bet is the Jays go after Manny,The reason,The gate draw.
The only drawback is they will trade Rios or keep Snider in the minors or they may trade Lind.

Rogers himself does not run the Jays,He has a board of directors that make all the decisions.
They would not have upped the payroll if the team was not making money,Also he owns rogers center outright so the team pays no rent.And he got it cheap just like the team.

I think we will see a lot of inhouse changes after Godfrey is gone,I don’t think the board is happy with the way Godfrey is running things,I can’t be sure of all of this but it is my guess.

Bosox.
Welcome to my parlor said the spider to the fly,BWA HA HA HA.
This should be a great serries and we owe you bigtime for the asskickin the DEVILSOX gave us the last time we met.lol.

Marcum’s having Tommy John surgery. Source: Bob McCown.

crap-he’s gone until spring of 2010. I wonder if they rushed him back too quickly.

Garry,
To be fair to Godfrey attendance has risen (albeit slightly) for 3 straight seasons and TV ratings continue to rise as well. I don’t know what more they can ask from him but I don’t know much about that stuff either.

On another note many people believe that if the decision is based on baseball only, J.P. stays but if it’s based on P.R. as well he’s gone. I’m indifferent about the whole thing. On the one hand I feel that on paper he has put a good team, Which is why for the most part I defend him. On the other I do feel where most of you are coming from, it’s been 7 years and they haven’t been near the playoffs.

I was very optimistic about this teams chances next year with or without J.P. but now with the news that Marcum will be gone for all of next year I am seriously concerned. When I first heard the news my immediate reaction was “fcuk” (great clothing brand). I think signing A.J. becomes even more of a priority now, with McGowan out untill May. This will likely take some cash out of the big bat search unfortunately though. Things suddenly look discouraging to me. It’s probably too much to ask but Casey Janssen will have to pitch well as early as he can especially if he is going to be a starter.

Enigma.
It looks like downs will be called upon to be a starter.If so I don’t mind because of Carlton a pitcher that came out of nowhere and can take Downs place as the 8th INN guy. Also Janssen could be back by late May.Purcey will have to get it together.One thing I find about this team is the pitchers seem to put it all together and I credit Arnsberg for I think he is a very good pitchen coach.
No matter who is the GM and providing they bring Cito back I think he will have a big say in who the Jays go after in the offseason if they go after anybody,
Then there is Dustin McGowan,If he comes back and his control is on they will be fine.
As for Marcum I think we all knew he was in trouble, all of us have been baseball fans for a lot of years and we have seen it all before so I don’t think we were too surprised about his condition,He was an asset and he will be missed next year but they have a lot of depth in the pitchen department.

Enigma
Hey, maybe lightning will strike twice in a row and two of Romero, Cecil, Wolfe and Jannsen will come through. Remember we would never have known how good Marcum and McGowan could be if it hadn’t been for injuries to others.

The Rogers center holds about 45 to 50 thousand people.when the Jays open the season at home they fill the house,But after that they draw about 19 thousand fans per game.One of Godfreys jobs is to fill the stands and he can’t do it.With 97 mil. per year the Jays should have been able to bring in some big name free agents that would draw the fans in.Now one thing for sure is the fans are in Toronto but there not going to the games.Godfrey was not a baseball man and JP had no experience and never should have been hired in the first place,But they thought Billy Beane taught him moneyball,Now why would Billy do something like that.my gate figures may be out a little.
Also when I said bring in free agents I did not mean hasbeens.

Attendance jumped in 2006, but then grew about 100 fans per game in 2007 and 2008 meaning it really levelled off. In the golden years we put 4 mill.+ in the stands, so fans do come when the team is winning.

I do think there’s a fair amount of dillusionment with fans on the team because of JP, but there’s been huge marketing and PR mistakes made over the last couple of years as well. Remember, this spring, Boston and NY fans got first dibs on tickets for games played here. Never before has a professional sports franchise given first right to tickets to the opposing team versus their own fans. It was the stupidist PR move I’ve ever seen and had to piss off a lot of fans.

The other thing that I think turned a number of fans away was Godfrey’s aggressive non-smoking policy. This has got to be the only stadium in MLB, were you cannot exit the stadium to have a smoke and re-enter. No smoking inside the arena is acceptable and the law, but to not allow smokers to exit, have a smoke and come back in is stupidity and represents Godfrey’s bleeding heart liberal views of life. 25% of Toronto’s population smoke, so Godfey just eliminated 25% of his potential market. Brilliant move-DUH. I know 15-20 guys who have never been to another game since and used to go to 10-15 games per year.

With the Yanks opening their new stadium next year, they will spare no expense in putting a winner on the field. Sabathia and Burnett should both be in pin-stripes, unless the Bosox or Dogers out bid for one of the two. This leaves the Bosox, Rays, and Jays fighting for one play-off position. The Jays have no hope. We should not deulude oursevles to think otherwise. With regards to our rotation: Halliday, Purcey, Litsch, and two others. Next year will be the year that we will really start to feel the effect of a weak farm system. I would love to see the Jays move some current players, if possible, and load up on young talent. The time to do this was at the trade deadline, but JP must be excused for trying to save his job for yet another year.

I think the Jays will be fine with pitching next year – one of the better staffs in the AL again. Between Downs, Cecil, Janssen, Romero, Mills, Tallett, and others, they can find find two fine starters. I’m sure JP will try to sign a few low risk/high reward pitchers. They probably won’t work out, but you never know when you’re gonna catch lightning in a bottle.

My main concern is whether or not the hitters will return to where there supposed to be statiscally. If so, they’ll be tough to beat. If not, it’ll be 07 and 08 all over again. I say it’s a 50% chance either way.

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