Game#91: Blue Jays at Red Sox pregame

Toronto (44-46) at Boston (55-35)
at 2:05 p.m. ET at Fenway Park

Today’s lineups:

Reed Johnson, LF
Alex Rios, RF
Vernon Wells, CF
Matt Stairs, DH
Troy Glaus, 3B
Lyle Overbay, 1B
Aaron Hill, 2B
Royce Clayton, SS
Jason Phillips, C

PITCHING: RHP Jesse Litsch

Coco Crisp, CF
Alex Cora, 2B
David Ortiz, DH
Manny Ramirez, LF
Kevin Youkilis, 1B
Mike Lowell, 3B
Eric Hinske, RF
Doug Mirabelli, C
Julio Lugo, SS

PITCHING: RHP Josh Beckett

NOTES: As announced after Saturday’s game, RHP Brandon League was activated from the 60-day disabled list and was at Fenway Park on Sunday afternoon. Gibbons said the club would likely keep him in a middle relief role to see how he pitches before possibly transitioning League into the setup role. League said he’s hitting between 93-95 mph with his fastball, and he’s had to learn to adjust to not having the overpowering high-90s heat. … Wells was out of the leadoff spot for the first time since June 30. … DH Frank Thomas was given the day off for the first time this season, minus in Interleague games on the road.



    good to see wells is back in the #3 hole. I think he can serve us better driving in runs, and Reed belongs in the #1 spot as our sparkplug


    Wells in the three hole perfect.I belive they will give him some hitable pitches with Stairs in the four hole.This year Stairs is a hitting machine who would have guessed it.Welcome back League.Iwas reading everybodys comments on pitchers past and present it makes for some very interesting reading.Although we are all humans were not all built the same.What I am trying to say is some pitchers can throw 130 per game and some 90 per game.Don’t all of you think it’s up to the manager to recognize this and use his pitchers according.Which Gibbons does not.


    Reed Johnson definetely belongs in the leadoff spot, he gets hit alot and he should have the highest on base percentage on the team. Vernon Wells is certainly a solid 3 hitter, how about Overbay in the 2 spot? I always like a good hitting lefty in that spot. What do you think of that Jays fans?


    im all for overbay in the #2 spot now that everybody’s healthy. rios needs to be in a position to drive in runs, and overbay was thriving in the 2 spot earlier in the year. but either way here works for me. i dont think it will make a huge difference if rios and overbay switch spots


    thegarry: But you realize that since Burnett is a strikeout pitcher, if you pull him after 90 pitches he’d often only be in until the 5th or 6th inning? So then the question is, why bother paying a guy that much money who rarely is going to get into the 7th inning?

    ukgocats: Correct me if I’m wrong, but I actually remember Overbay really struggling in the #2 spot. I think he even admitted to not feeling comfortable batting in that position, so Gibbons dropped him down the order just before his injury. In general, Overbay’s numbers this year have not been great. Hopefully he picks it up in the second half….

  6. I was never for Burnett comming to Toronto in the first place.Burnett was on the DL I think six times before JP made him a rich man.What made him think he was going to stay healthy from then on.Now take the Doc.he’s a horse Marcum is stronger than McGowan I don’t know about jessie yet.We have League in the bullpen who’s the DUMMY warming up Jansen duh.I’m sure League can go two then Accardo and give the rest of the bullpen the day off.


    Win, lose or draw

    For the record, I think Gibby made the right decision lifting Jessie and bringing in Downs to face Coco.

    And how about Jessie-what a start. Goes head to head with the winniest pitcher in The American league and out duels him. In Fenway Park no less.


    Jessie did a great job.Game not over yet but who knows.Is beckett being left in to long????.


    Am I the only one that thinks the Blue Jays need to go after Rangers SS Michael Young? He is a productive RBI man and he hits for a high average, not to mention great defense. The Rangers appear to be shopping around their players, possibly looking to rebuild. We don’t necessarily need him at the trade deadline this year, but maybe at the Winter Meetings in the offseason. I think if we dealt the Rangers one of our pitching prospects we might be able to pull him out of Arlington (not to mention that he is Vernon Wells’s best friend)


    thats probley not going to happen with the huge contract he signed just a little while ago. as much as i’d like to see michael young in a jays jersey, hes a cornerstone, and probley isnt one of the people texas will give up. nice thought, but probley not to realistic. and even if it was possible, the price that texas would ask for would be a huge one, probley two elite starting prospects and a positioned playing that will make it to the bigs (ex, a mcgowan, and marcum with a lind type of player)



    I agree with you about going after him. I can not remember the last time we had a productive short stop. Although, what pitching prospect did you have in mind? Because I would hate to part with Marcum or Macgowen.


    80 mil over 5 years is the contract he signed. that would be huge on top of the wells contract we have. thats alot of money. unless the rangers would pay for a good chunk of that 🙂 maybe we have to go after some one more like felipe lopez. i think that would be a better idea. or that short stop in colorado. any idea who are the free agent shortstops in the comming year anyone ?



    I was thinking maybe a guy like Janssen put together with Lind + class A prospect could fetch Young.


    yes he does have a pretty big contract, but I’m just throwing ideas out. As for Tulowitzki, I seriously doubt Colorado would part with him. Lopez would not be much of an improvement, and I would defintely not support a trade to get him, especially one that included core prospects.


    yea man i agree with you all the way. i would like to see young, its just really hard to see happening. just being realiztic. i mean i would love for him to be in toronto. but i think we gotta look at idea that are more possible.
    and btw ukgocats

    for lopez, we probley wouldn’t be looking at our elite prospects, just solid ones, like maybe wolfe, dejong, or a roberts. maybe package two of them, with a low A player. who knows.


    yeah still im just not a big fan of the way he plays. I personally dont have a problem with McDonald being the everyday shortstop here, but it doesn’t look as if that’s going to happen. We do have a surplus in pitching prospects (as long as Burnett and Chacin get healthy, which is a big if), and I would like to see some production out of the shortstop position. Clayton was an awful signing and he should be riding the bench, even if he does have one of the coolest nicknames in baseball…


    Young turns 32 this year. As much as I like him, I’d hate to see the Jays tied to that contract. His production was down last year and this year it continues to slide.

    His HR’s fell from 24 to 14 last year and to date this year he only has 4. In addition his BA has dropped this year.

    I don’t expect those numbers to improve as he ages-I can’t imagine why The Rangers extended him to 2013.


    Still he would give increased production out of the SS position. He may not be the answer, I just dont like our situation at SS right now


    yea i agree. but we might just have to live with mcdonald/clayton for now. any other ideas for other possible shortstops besides the ones alrighty mentioned ?


    One of the short stops I like is Hanley Ramirez of Miami. Only 24, BA of .331, 14 Hr’s and a salary of $402k. Not great defensively, but still young.

    I also like John Macdonald.

    He’s one of the best defenders there is, and seems to have developed a bit more of a bat this year. Great attitude-good team player.


    i really like ramirez too. but no way florida parts with that kinda talent at that young of an age. hes got two years left before arbitration. so i dont see them letting him go period. hes a special player for sure. that would be an amazing move if we got him althow.


    as for mcdonald. bat – not so much. hes never gonna be an offensive star. incredible defensivly. like absolutly amazing. but i think we need more offence out of shortstop. your thoughts ?


    Yeah there is no way Ramirez leaves Florida, especially for the kind of players we could offer.

    I agree about McDonald, but the Toronto organization doesn’t. I would be perfectly happy with him playing everyday, but that does not look like it will happen.


    Zero chance that Hanley Ramirez is dealt, he is in his 2nd full season, he is not a free agent for another 4 years or so. The Marlins own his rights for a while. Marlins have descions to make on Cabrera and Willis, what to do? Trade them or try to sign them? Cabrera isn’t much of a fielder but will give you 40 H.R.’s per season and those type of guys don’t grow on trees.


    Well Miami is weak in power hitters in the outfield. They’re also very weak in left handed power hitters so a Lind for Ramirez deal might have appeal.


    Short stop is primarily a defenseive position, theres nothing wrong with us staying with macdonald and waiting for one of our youngsters like Santos to show up


    I think they will wait to see how Hermida and Abercrombie progress before they make any moves for an outfielder


    You know most of us have said all along that we have a good team despite all the injuries the Jays have had.How big is it to go into Boston with one ACE and three rookies and split.My take very very big.Jessie proves today he can pitch in the bigs.Now for Young “BIG YES”.If the Jays can pay Burnett[sorry gsummer]11 mil per year they can pay young.Trade Thomas keep Stairs get Young.


    The days of SS being a primarily defensive position are over, especially in the hard-hitting American League. If the Jays really want to contend, they need someone who has a career average well-above .240 and who can do more than hit singles and occasionally move a runner over. I love Johnny Mac, but he’s a bench player at best. Last year, for example, his numbers dropped dramatically as soon as he was handed the everyday job.

    Although it would be great to get Young from Texas, that ship has sailed. The Jays don’t have nearly enough to offer Texas to pry Young away from them. Also, a Ramirez for Lind deal is kind of a pipe dream — Ramirez has at least proven he can hit at the Major League level, Lind has not. As with Young and Texas, to get Ramirez from Florida the Jays would have to give up a whole lot more than Lind.

    As far as Burnett goes, the Jays are stuck with him whether they like it or not. Pitching is hard to come by, but not enough for teams to take an injury-prone guy like Burnett off our hands. I think the Jays should probably hold onto him, but he definitely shouldn’t be our #2 guy. A #2 guy needs to be able to pitch more than 90-100 pitches in a game without his arm falling off. Burnett’s got great stuff, but he’s proving that he can’t be trusted to step it up when the Jays really need him to eat up innings and show consistency….


    i think it will come hopefully. we’ve seen some excelence from burnett, and he was at the loseing end when we went though that rough offensive strech in may, and burnett was solid. sure he hasnt done maybe but we might have hoped for, but this guy still stricks out a load of guys, and can be solid (provided he’s healthy… witch doesnt happen much but still)

    as for short, we are going to need an upgrade, weither it be in the off season, or some deal at the deadline. mcdonald is a wiz with the glove but we need a aaron hill type of hitter at short. as much as we would all like the young/ramirez type of player, chances are, it wont happen. we need at least someone solid, in the middle class, who can hit for an average at least, who can play solid defence, and occasionaly hit a few out.

    anyways good game today

    litsch looked extremely solid. its good to know we have a few good young guys who can throw a good game.


    Yeah, I just looked up Ramirez’s stats — this guy’s amazing! If the Jays could somehow pick him up, J.P. should be GM of the year!


    Canadian: Don’t get me wrong, I’d love for Burnett to fulfill all the hype and promise. But what use is a hard-throwing, strike-out pitcher if he can’t pitch more than 100 pitches in a game? As I mentioned earlier, 100 pitches often doesn’t get a strikeout pitcher past the 5th or 6th inning. That definitely doesn’t cut it for a so-called #2 starter!


    its not happening. ramirez is young, and is still in the orginasation’s control for the next 5 years. if florida actually was dumb enough to trade away a talent like that, the asking price would be through the roof. maybe even more then young would need. besides this guy is making minnimum for this year and next year. if they trade him away that would be the steal of the year for toronto. but i really dont they’re that dumb… i dont think they are anyways 😛



    Are you for real when you say Lind for Ramirez? Ramirez was the rookie of the year in the N.L. last year. Adam Lind couldn’t even carry Ramirez’s jock. There is absolutely no way of that deal happening. If you know anything about baseball you wouldn’t even suggest that.


    sure its not great, but there has been games when burnett has pitched into the 7th with around 100. im alright with that. 7 innings is solid. burnett might have to take some advice from doc, and learn to pitch more to contact. i noticed earlier in the year, he was doing that and having sucess. the strickouts will always be there, but i know he can pitch effectivly. i dunno. maybe im crazy on this one, but i think he can and will be the solid 2 starter we want and need. maybe not every night, but 8 out of 10 nights i think he can pitch into the 7th or 8th with a count around 100 – 110. and even if his arm seams to strugle with that, i think its possible.


    we spent the money, and we gotta make the best of it.

    and its not like we havnt seen good nights from him. i think your focusing on his last few outings before the injury more then all the starts hes made in the past 2 years.



    Canadian: Yeah, let’s hope he finally pulls it together. Do you know when he’s scheduled to come back? Last I heard he had another “setback”, so he might be out longer than expected.

    And, definitely, it’d be great if he could learn a bit from Doc. Not only how to pitch for contact, but also how to carry himself like a true Major League pitcher. I think Jeff Blair of the Globe and Mail put it best when he described Burnett as pretty “flaky”….


    i think we’ll have him mid – end of august. (dont take my word on it, im not sure) but i dont want him rushing back. and u know if it takes that long so be it. id rather have him healty then being flaky and comeing back and then getting injured again. then i would really flip 😛 who knows really. i just like the though of halladay, burnett, chacin, mcgowan, and marcum – all healthy. i think when he pitches to contact hes more effective. of course he’ll still get his strickouts that way, but its the mindset that he needs. and i’ll agree with u about needing to carry himself like a mlb pitcher. i think (and hope) it will come sooner or later. hopefully this setback, will get him to thinking. and who knows maybe we’ll see a better burnett when he does finally get back (lets hope)


    Mid-August? Man oh man, I had no idea it was that bad. I was thinking sometime in July. Oh well, maybe he’ll learn a thing or two watching from the bench!

    Good talking to you, buddy. Have a good night….


    *my bad – begginging of august. first week – ish is when hes suppost to be back. mis read the article i was reading (he being burnett)


    It’s great to read all the postings from everyone good baseball talk then along comes bosoxbrian with his ignorant remarks to gsummer for no reason but to stir up c-rap.The last thing we need is to get gsummer going.Ifor one like the fact that he spends a lot of time looking for new sites for us and he knows his baseball.I don’t think he needs to be attacked.


    You need to ignore people like bosoxbrian , they crave attention and when you respond to him you are giving him his attention fix . He trashs the Jays and Yankees on Boston’s blog . Today he couldn’t accept the fact ” Jays no name pitcher ( as he referred to Litsch) beat Boston’s ace ”
    Yes thank you gsumner for all your baseball input , its greatly appreciated


    Any person that thinks Lind for Hanley Ramirez is a even trade is a person that knows absolutely nothing about the game of baseball. Who in there right mind would say that or even think that. This gsumner is the same guy that said if Burnett got a 100 million contract it would o.k. with him. I don’t bash the Jays and Yankees, I call it the way I see it. Your no name pitcher is a no name pitcher because in less than a year he’ll be riding the bus from Syracuse and points beyond. I give the Jays credit, if you read what I write, apparently that is tough for you to do. The Jays have kicked Boston’s tail in the last year or so. I call it the way I see it. For some reason some fans on these sites are blinded by the organzation that they root for and I think people like that are very simple minded people who can’t think for themselves.


    GO to the boston site and read where beckett I got outpiched I lost.I respect him for that.


    I wouldn’t say Beckett got outpitched during this game today. Beckett seemed to be in alot of jams but got himself out of them. The reason the Jays won was because this Red Sox offense has disappeared way too many times this year. On Thursday night Halladay gets racked and then today they get shutdown by this no name kid. The no name kid did well today but let’s face it next time out he’ll get tagged. I believe he’ll be pitching in front of family and friends his next time out vs Seattle on Friday night. If Beckett pitches like this he’ll get alot of wins in the second half. When you don’t have your best stuff and still only allow 2 runs that says alot to me.


    I love baseball , all baseball . I have my favorite teams and I appreciate all teams . Go read your own postings were you call the Jays a very poor poor team among other comments . You also post nasty comments at the Yanks site . You say we have no pitching after Halladay , well 2 of those pitchers just beat your sox. Who do you have after Beckett ? Dice-k ? Schilling who is on the DL again ? Dice is a good pitcher but at this point not great and after him you have nobody . Sox are a very good team this year but they got outplayed today ,atleast Beckett has the courtesy to admit that and give kudoes when he is outpitched . Beckett is a strikeout pitcher , Litsch is not so he is going to induce groundouts


    That no name kid almost pitched a no -hitter his first time out . He will settle into his role as a pitcher and be around for a long time . Every team has its ups and downs , this may be Boston’s down. Jays have had more than their share of downs


    If your happy with the way the Jays have been put together coming into the 2007 season, it is obvious to me you are blinded my friend. When the season started I thought the Blue Jays were nothing but a .500 team. After Halladay there starters are quite average and there pen before Ryan had major question marks. I thought that Boston and N.Y. would fight to the end like they did back in 2005 but N.Y. got a rash of injuries and Boston’s pitching ruled. Remember Beckett also went on the D.L. as well for 15 days. For some reason people forget about that. When I say after Halladay the starters aren’t there, I can’t believe that you Blue Jays fans were happy about the rotation coming into the year. If the Red Sox started the year with that roatation Theo Epstein would have been run out of town. You Blue Jay fans are accepting it and to me if I was a Jays fan it would be unacceptable to me. That is why I say J.P. has done a poor job with this team, he is the one that assembled this team. Red Sox pitching is one the best in baseball and for you to say otherwise you really don’t know what your talking about. Please read comments here but if you don’t know what you are talking about DON’T COMMENT!!!


    Juan Nieves pitched a no hitter does that make him one of the greatest lefties of all time? Roger Clemens has NEVER pitched a no hitter. The no name kid has pitched very well his last 2 starts that does not translate into someone that is going to be around for a long time. Remember Glavine and Smoltz how many losses they had when they were young pitchers? How about Bonderman that 03 season pitching with the Tigers how many losses he had but you could see that he was going to be a good one. I don’t think this no name kid is going to be much. Just my opinion here, you guys don’t know what to do when someone comes on here and has strong opinions. Remember what they say about Toronto baseball fans not the most knowledgeable fans in the game!!!


    Litsch has a lot of composure on the mound nonamebrian also he is a rookie only time will tell wheather he will make it or not.when halliday first came up he to threw a one hitter but before he made it he had to go all the way back to -a- ball would you have called him your name noname the way his name is Jessie Litsch. now say it over and over until you learn it.If you want us to treat you like an adult act like one dont insult our team or us.If you want to talk baseball with out insults we’re game.


    Yanks got a rash of…. We have 1 of our starting pitchers still pitching not to mention all the other injuries jays have suffered . Beckett’s 15 day on the DL doesn’t compare to Burnett going down yet again , Doc’s 3 weeks with surgery , Chacin being gone since April. Where has anyone said they were happy about our pitching situation , try reading what is posted . Thompson, Zambrano and Ohka are no longer with the Jays for good reason but the rookies that have all stepped in to take over have done a great job and atleast helped to keep this team going . As for pitching , I believe Tigers and Angels have it in the AL and one of those 2 teams will win the AL title.I call it like I see it and I am far from blind . Jays outplayed Boston today , why is that so hard for you to accept


    I actually watched Halladay pitch against Clearwater at old Jack Russell Stadium and he threw less than 10 pitches in that 1 inning of relief. My ex-girlfriend who I went with said who is that guy and what is he doing here? He really stuck out to her and she knew nothing about the game of baseball. I know who the no name kid is. He is from Pinellas County where I live and went to U.S.F. over in Tampa. I don’t call anyone names on here, for some reason you guys take it personal and I think that is funny. I have strong opinions about the game and how teams construct there bussiness and I think the Jays front office is not good. The Jays had some mo going into the winter after there 2nd place finish in 2006 and they almost won 90 games. They added Thomas and I thought that was a bad move. Why bring in a aging superstar? Who did they add to there rotation? Zambrano couldn’t throw a strike if his life depended on it. Ryan when healthy is one of the better closers in the game but before him there was major question marks in my opinion. Remember every team that breaks camp has question marks and some are answered early and others become strengths of the team. Boston when they broke camp had the makings of a very good rotation and that is the case right now. Also you have to get a couple of guys to come out of nowhere and that is case with Okijima, he has been lights out for the Red Sox. When it comes to blogging here I say bring strong opinions here and no name calling, act like adults, remember it is just a game and to me it is great entertainment.


    There are things in life you can gurantee and they are the following. Death, taxes and A.J. Burnett getting hurt. If there was anyone out there that thought he was going to make 30 or more starts I would like to sell them a bridge in Brooklyn. Chacin I will give you that one, he is a good #3 or #4 starter. Remember about Chacin he had that D.U.I. and that is never a good omen. Halladay being out that time hurt but the Jays were falling apart there a bit anyway.

    I say and I have said all year that the Tigers are the team to beat in baseball and Boston and the Angels are a notch below them. Yankees got there rash of injuries because they hired a strength coach that was hanging out at a country club in Florida. Great move there by the Yankees.


    It amazes me since Jays fans are supposedly so “ignorant” when it comes to ball , why would an avid Bosox fan want to talk ball here ? All fans are passionate about the team they love but they also need to be realistic . I am a realist, I love the Jays but I am not blind to their faults . A little praise goes a heck of a lot further than constant criticism . I would rather look at the glass as half full than half empty


    I did call gsumner some names but that was after he said stuff to me. That was Friday and that is all over with. Let’s stick to baseball here and as I say bring strong opinions. Have a great night everyone.


    I’m a Red Sox fan and believe you me over the years I had to look at there team as half full. Many times the season was over before it started under the Yawkey’s and John Harrington. I know what your saying there but some stuff let’s open your eyes folks. It is right in front of you.


    My eyes are wide open . Now you have to admit Beckett got outpitched today …lol..common its not that hard to say…… Like i said earlier Boston is a great team but even great teams have down time . Have a good evening everyone.


    Beckett went 8 innings and this no name kid got into the 7th. What is Beckett supposed to say, my offense has disappeared again. Many times this year the Red Sox hitters have made average pitchers look good, the no name kid gave up 9 hits. Once again the Sox did not come up with the big hit. If they don’t turn that around they will be a early exit in the playoffs.



    Hey I heard they put a price on your head on The Yankee site. Do you wear out your welcome on all sites or do you have preferences?

    How does it feel to have a rook outpitch your ace?

    Our guys played well in this series. To go into Boston and have 3 youngsters pitch and split the series is impressive. To have a raw rookie outpitch the ace is more impressive. Beckett will probably have nightmares.Could set him back for the season.(lol) I particulary like how Francono kept him in there, piling up the pitch count. There will be a price to be paid for that-and you heard it from me first.

    Too bad we didn’t face Shilling-we would have bombed him too.


    Hey guys

    I didn’t say we would get Ramirez. I said I’d like him-particulary better than Young.


    It was Boston’s defence along with pitching that gave up 2 runs to the Jays . Litsch’s pitching along with Jays defence prevented Boston from scoring more than 1 run. Boston had 11 hits not 9. How come its alright for you to defend Boston yet we are too sensitive when we defend the jays ? Like I said we all love our teams


    Hem-would you do me a favor

    and back off your rhetoric on Burnett. It’s getting boring to continually read the same thing. This is not meant to upset you or anything, but let it go-theres more topics to chat about.


    The no name kid gave up 9 hits, read what I wrote please. You know the team you root for is not very good because the Jays are happy about the split while I am sure the Red Sox are not too happy about it. Big difference there in the organazations and the fan base.

    To gsumner your team scored 2 runs and that is a bombing? Now that is funny to me. I have strong opinions on baseball and for some reason some folks can’t take it. You said Lind for Ramirez, read what you wrote.


    At the end of the day-there’s only one thing, as a Jays fan to remember.

    Our guys had “must win” situations in the Oakland series, Cleveland series and this game today.

    And guess what-they dug deep in every one of them and won all 3. Jessie pitched in two of these games and Towers the other.

    Say what you want-this team is starting to build character.

    We get stronger every day from here on in. It ain’t over till the fat lady sings-and she hasn’t even found the band yet.

    Now bring on those nasty Yanks-lets whip their behind


    I would have to agree with you there gsumner. The Jays are starting to turn the corner and splitting the 4 game set at Fenway might get the Jays rolling. I am not sure that the Red Sox can recover. LOL…………..


    Hey Bosox-we came into your house and split-with 3 starting pitchers who for all intents and purposes are rooks. Your ace couldn’t compete today-he lost..

    When you come back to The Rodgers Center, we will treat you appropriately and wipe the carpet with your guys. If I was a Red Sox fan, Id be embarrased-getting beat by a 22 year old kid still wet behind the ears. lol

    And hey if FLorida would do a deal of Lind for Ramarez-it would be great. Would they-likely not. But the discussion at the time was “favorite shortstop”.

    Now quit trying so hard to start a confrontation and go back to the Yankees site-I hear theyre looking for ya.


    The no name kid gave up 11 hits , go check the box score . Since they were playing Boston , that means Boston got 11 hit, 1 run . I do read and comprehend…try it sometime


    correction……Boston did get 11 hits but only one run ..Litsch gave up 9 runs.I apologize . They still had 11 hits and our defence shut them down


    The no name kid gave up 9 hits over 6.2 innings. Downs gave up 1 hit and Janssen gave up 1 hit. That adds up to 11 hits. I am giving out a math lesson tonight, is anyone interested?


    The no name kid gave up 1 run not 9 runs. Hey indigo I think you are too tired, get some rest.


    The jays have won two boston has won one let me see what was it now oh now I remember it was the world series need I say more. indigo you hit the nail on the head when you said we love our team.One thing we don’t have to do to get off is make fun of other teams.I like it when we play boston or new york most of the time it’s good baseball.but I hate to have our team made fun of all the time by nonamebrian.


    Oh Bosox-One Last Thing

    Who is your third base coach? He should be fired. Everyone else in baseball knows you don’t run on Rios. Your guy was out by a mile of two.

    Also talk to Francona and tell him he should be getting Beckett to toss 120 pitches every game. It’ll likely improve him.



    Actually garryguy Boston has won more than 1 world series. You need to get your facts straight. When you folks get on here get your facts straight and bring strong opionions. It is better that way. Don’t you Jays fans agree? You guys don’t know what to do when someone comes on here knows what is going on with baseball.



    i totally agree with your post earlier about building character, and its good and refreshing to see a true fan thats got some loyalty to a ball club.


    im tired of your constant demeaning remarks against the jays. this is a JAYS site for JAYS fans. if you have something productive and meaningful to say, say it. but if your gonna keep coming with this ****, get off the site. i dont think anyone really wants you here. we know litsch gave up 9 hits. we’re not saying he is the next nolan ryan. we are applauding him because he is a rookie and he came into an intmidating Fenway Park and outpitched the ace.


    bosox,It doesn’t matter

    how many hits Jessie gave up or whether he has a name or not. What matters is he beat Beckett. We win-you lose.

    I heard Beckett has developed a Jessie complex-can you comment on that? ROTFLMAO


    I wouldn’t fire Demarlo Hale, he is actually a pretty decent 3rd base coach. I don’t really agree sending Oritz with Rios out there. Toronto’s 3rd base coach is very good, Brian Butterfield. Beckett’s first outing since July 5th so throwing 120 pitches will not kill him, Beckett is a horse.


    bosox, you’re quite right Boston has won more than one world series. One recently and the other in 189–what was it again; 1892 or 1983?



    First of all I am not a guy and secondly I stated I don’t pretend to know everything . Opinions are like ……. we all have one . I will give english lessons if you want them bosox . I realized my mistake and apologized for it


    I think Beckett along with the pitchers are wondering where is there offense? Making no name pitchers look good. Boston will be in the playoffs and Toronto will be where gsumner?


    Horses come and go. If you don’t care for them right-they don’t perform. Remember what happened to Shilling after he pitched an almost no-no. Watch

    Sort of like a female-know what I mean?


    Boston has won more than 1 but the others were against Christopher Columbus and who knows who else. Sad but true the Jays have only been around since 1977 and they have 2 titles. Those 2 titles had some really great players on them. Cetainly J.P. will never see that.



    Don’t count the chickens until all the roosters are in the barn, son. It’s a long ways from over yet. We’re coming on strong and your guys are getting beat by 22 year old rooks.

    Know what I mean???????


    McGowan as well after he threw his no no. They both got bombed after, Schilling is a borderline hall of famer and it would be nice if he came back. Some say he’ll be back at the end of this month.


    Clearly you have an issue with JP-why?

    Does it bother you to finally see one Massachusetts guy do well?


    Well, the difference is Shilling went on the DL. If you over use and abuse-you can no longer use.

    Watch what happens to Beckett if Francono keeps using him like he did today. It sort of reminds me how he used Pedro.


    I would like to see J.P. do well. It is always nice to see Mass guys do well and New Englanders. I don’t think he has done a very good job. Theo Epstein has done a great job in building there farm system not so good with the free agents. Some of his trades have been either really good or just plain old bad.


    Pedro was burned out before Francona came there. Pedro is a little guy and Beckett is very strong. You can’t even compare that. How about Dice-K, he throws at least 100 pitches per game and only Zambrano from the Cubs have averaged more pitches than Dice-K. Beckett’s issue is he has blister problems.


    I doubt Shilling will ever make the Hall. Only thing he has going for him is a bloody sock-which apparently was nothing other than a ruse.

    Amazing what you Boston guys do to get press, must be an inferiortity complex to New York. What do you think?


    Francona only managed Pedro for 1 year so when you say how Francona used Pedro to me that does not make any sense.


    Hey, I say have Beckett throw 120 pitches a game-he’s a horse. If I managed Dice k would be out there for 9 innings regardless of pitch count-even if it got to 150.


    Who do you blame Burnett’s issues on? How about Halladay????? Sometimes it comes down to the individual. Burnett is a wimp and that is pretty much fact. He feels something and he shuts it down, I am sure Burnett isn’t the most respected guy in that clubhouse.


    Bosox-too bad you don’t manage the Sox-would you apply for the job-maybe Francono is on his way out?

    Certainly looks to me that you know more about baseball than he does.


    I don’t know, I havent been in the clubhouse for a while. I will tell you this thogh, Burnett got a ton of respect from the other members of the team when he pitched like he did with Halliday down.

    By the way Halliday rarely thows over 100-105 pitches-unless it’s a 10 inning game.


    So Schilling took the mound on game 6 of the A.L.C.S. with catsup. Just what Schilling wanted to show was weakness in the ankle, are you kidding me???? Yankees were quite dumb that night with a older pitcher and the bad ankle they never tried to bunt. How come nobody talks about that? Schilling also pitched game 2 of the World Series with a little blood on it and nobody talks about that.


    Francona is a good manager, of course his job is easier beacause he is surrounded by alot of talent. How about your manager Gibbons? Not the brightest around and J.P. gave him an extension. Brillant move by J.P.


    I would be willing to bet that Burnett is looked at a little different in that clubhouse. Sometimes you have to take the mound when your not your best and that guy certainly doesn’t have the moxie. That is obvious, he has the hardware but not the software.


    It wasn’t blood-we both know that.

    Anyway no way does that get him into the Hall.

    Gibby is sourrounded by a lot of talent as well.

    Hey, I’m tired and done playing with you tonight.

    So go back to the NY board-those boys are looking for ya and put a price on your head.

    See you when we wup your butts in The Rogers Center


    I will give you Francona is a good manager and Boston is a good team . Even Boston has some questionable players and Epstein has made some rather poor decisions . I am not a fan of Gibby but Ted Rogers isn’t going to listen to me …lol…


    gsumner: No offense to you either, but you’ve got to stop picking fights with people on these boards. The other night was bad enough with your slew of anti-American comments and juvenile insults, but this is getting ridiculous.

    As far as Burnett goes, I don’t understand why I can’t talk to another poster on this board about him when there’s no one else around but me and him. You’ve got to chill out, my friend….

  98. in the first place gsummer did not start this nonamebrian did. and as for burnett gsummer has to respect your right to give your opinion.I think shilling will make the hall but I wonder if he will dye his socks red again to wear in lol.Tower power tomorow go Jays



    gsumner and myself last night were talking baseball here. I don’t know why you 2 have an issue with that. gsumner has his observations and I have mine, some we agree on and others we disagree. Not a problem here and it isn’t with gsumner as well I would assume.


    The bickering has made this a less fun place to talk Jays and baseball.

    Bosoxbrian: this will likely be the only response I direct at you. Please don’t turn this site into a comment wasteland. I’m sure you think you represent the ‘devil’s advocate’, but there’s a much more mature and effective way to do so.

    To everyone else: if brian doesn’t smarten up, ignore him.

    On the lighter side, here’s hoping Josh can continue his recent good performance.


    I have been reading the last couple of days with no post and it is my opinion that Bosoxbrian is really a Jays fan trying to stir up some action here. I mean look at the number of post recently compared to a couple weeks ago to the beginning of the season. Good job Bosoxbrian.
    Nice one, you got us good.


    tower you’r right if we want to keep it up with bosoxbrian we can do it on the boston site where they don’t like him either.This is the last time I post anything on this site with his name on it.Now for josh towers I hope he keeps it up he can pitch when he wants to.Litsch was good last night the defence was also good to a point.Beckett pitched a good game also but it was our turn to win.I hope the doc finds himself for his next game he looks troubled on the mound.To indigo I did not know you were a girl we have no way of telling .If I for one said anything to offend you you have my most sincere apology.Jordan or anyone who do you think should lead off wells or johnson. last night they were both ofers.I think JP told gibby to put wells back in the three hole for a better chance at more rbi’s.One day ago gibby said he liked wells in the leadoff spot and he had no plans to change it.

  103. Jordan

    Why switch when something’s working? Wells was doing well as the leadoff guy and I personally think Rios should stick to the No. 3 spot. If they want Wells out of the No. 1 hole, maybe slide him in the two spot with Johnson leading off. So basically, for now, I like a combo of Wells and Johnson in either of the Nos. 1-2 spots, with Rios hitting third. Johnson looks like he’s trying to get his timing back still. Three months off can do that to a guy.


    Jordan, actually I thought Bosox might have been sent by MLB to stir up interest, since he’s been activally posting on so many sites.

    I agree with your assessment of Rios being in number 3 and not changing something that’s working.

    I like Johnson leading off, Wells number two. Rios is starting to bud into the MVP we all thought him capable off. He is also starting to get hits at important times to tie the score or win the game, so I like him number 3.

    I hope our guys aren’t too motivated for the Yank series. I can imagine them wanting full back payment for A-Rod’s little incident here. Just hope they don’t try too hard.










    I would try that tonight.

    I like the jays’ chances of taking 3 of 4 in this series. K. Igawa (sp?) hasn’t been lights out exactly, Roy Halladay is due for a good start tomorrow and Shaun Marcum has shown that he can hold his own (albeit coming off a rough outing).


    I belive your right Jordan.gsummer I’m with you on retaliating after all this time. A-Rod is a cheat and he’s not worth the effort.We dont have to worry about Towers knocking him down slow fastball.have company have to go.



    A-rod plays 3rd base. I don’t think he will want to stand on the bag if a gamer like Zaun or Johnson is sliding in.

    But my personal preference is to wup them and bury them for the season which we’ll do if we sweep.


    Some interesting arms in the minors.

    All the pr’s on this years’ draftees seemed to focus on the bats; but it appears we have some up and coming arms as well. Check these guys out.

    Gulf Coast: Brian Letko 18.2 innings era of .000; James Doughen 21 innings, 20 k’s, era of 1.29.

    At the DSL-2 team: Carlos Rodriguez, 24 innings, era of 1.46 with 20 k’s.

    Auburn-Cecil Brett, 1.1 innings with 18K’s, era of 1.10

    Lansing-Adrian Martin: 43.1 innings and an era of .83.

    New Hampshire: Seth Overbey started the season at Lansing, went 24.2 innings era of .000, earned his promotion to Dunedin where he went 10 innings and gave up one run, earned his promotion to New Hampshire.

    So this guy has jumped from A- to A+ to AA in under 3 months. He has had one bad outing in New Hamsphire where he gave up 5 runs-other than that it’s been .000. Must be special and he’s only 23.


    A-Rod better look out in this series because the Jays are going to came after him hard, let’s hope it will be a clean play. Perhaps Halladay will line him up with a pitch on Tuesday. What A-Rod did up in Toronto was a bush league play and to me that is classless for sure. With Igawa pitching and with all the right handed bats that the Jays have they should be able to knock him out by the 5th and then work on that shaky Yankees pen. Igawa has been a disaster signing by the Yankees!!! This past winter he might have been the worst signing in baseball.


    gsummer I like those stats but check out cecil brett thats a lot of k’s.So far it looks like we have a lot of pitchers doing a great job.Lets hope a few of them make it.only one more hour for the game.I can hardley wait for Jordan to post the lineup.enigma posted a neat lineup.


    the garry

    Sorry typing mistake-he pitched 16.1 innings for the 18k’s. thanks for noting the mistake

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